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External
Since: Aug 15, 2003
Posts: 5
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2003 2:35 pm
Post subject: 21+ inch CRTs
Archived from groups: comp>sys>ibm>pc>hardware>video (more info?)
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Ok, so I think my dream of a 20-21 inch LCD is dying because they all
seem to have a native resolution of 1600X1200 and that's too small for
me. So I'm looking at CRT's once again and am wondering what the best
flat screens are these days. I rarely play games so I think text
quality is more important to me, and I've heard conflicting reports on
whether or not Trinitrons are better than shadow masks in this regard.
I was looking at the G220fb though I've seen complaints here about
blurry text. Does anyone have any first-hand experience with current
21+ inch CRTs that they can share?
Thanks,
James |
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External
Since: Feb 09, 2004
Posts: 11
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2003 7:13 pm
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"James Kilton" <kilton9.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:212002a7.0308161035.44881555@posting.google.com...
> Ok, so I think my dream of a 20-21 inch LCD is dying because they all
> seem to have a native resolution of 1600X1200 and that's too small for
> me. So I'm looking at CRT's once again and am wondering what the best
> flat screens are these days. I rarely play games so I think text
> quality is more important to me, and I've heard conflicting reports on
> whether or not Trinitrons are better than shadow masks in this regard.
>
> I was looking at the G220fb though I've seen complaints here about
> blurry text. Does anyone have any first-hand experience with current
> 21+ inch CRTs that they can share?
I have two off-lease 21" monitors, one with 1280x1024 and the other with
1600x1200. When you say the native 1600x1200 is too small, do you mean that
you want a lower resolution so that text will be bigger? As you khow,
unlike LCDs, CRTs can be run at lower than 'native' resolution with no
detrimental effects. While the 'native' resolution quality of LCDs and
Plasmas is better, the ability of the CRT to run effectively at almost any
resolution, and the low cost of off-lease equipment is nominal. I have
found, in addition, that when run at lower than 'native' ( or the highest
supported ) resolutions, inexpensive CRT's display quality actually
increases ( in which case I would recommend a Trinitron over a shadow
mask ). Of course, with the Trinitron you have the aperture grille support
wire lines...<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> |
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External
Since: Jul 18, 2003
Posts: 10
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2003 9:05 pm
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"James Kilton" <kilton9 DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:212002a7.0308161035.44881555@posting.google.com...
> Ok, so I think my dream of a 20-21 inch LCD is dying because they all
> seem to have a native resolution of 1600X1200 and that's too small for
> me. So I'm looking at CRT's once again and am wondering what the best
> flat screens are these days. I rarely play games so I think text
> quality is more important to me, and I've heard conflicting reports on
> whether or not Trinitrons are better than shadow masks in this regard.
>
> I was looking at the G220fb though I've seen complaints here about
> blurry text. Does anyone have any first-hand experience with current
> 21+ inch CRTs that they can share?
>
> Thanks,
> James
I've heard good things about Mitsubishi 2070SB (or NEC equivalent 2171FP),
it's a 22" CRT with 20" viewable. Here's a link to full specs:
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.necmitsubishi.com/products/home/ProductDetail.cfm?product_id=232&division=MITSUBISHI" target="_blank">http://www.necmitsubishi.com/products/home/ProductDetail.cfm?product_i...32&divi</a>
Betelgeuse,
Armpit of the Giant
=============================================
"I Am Become Death, The Destroyer Of Worlds!"
=============================================
betelg [ at ] cogeco [ dot ] ca<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Jul 18, 2003
Posts: 10
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2003 9:17 pm
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"James Kilton" <kilton9 RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:212002a7.0308161035.44881555@posting.google.com...
> Ok, so I think my dream of a 20-21 inch LCD is dying because they all
> seem to have a native resolution of 1600X1200 and that's too small for
> me. So I'm looking at CRT's once again and am wondering what the best
> flat screens are these days. I rarely play games so I think text
> quality is more important to me, and I've heard conflicting reports on
> whether or not Trinitrons are better than shadow masks in this regard.
>
> I was looking at the G220fb though I've seen complaints here about
> blurry text. Does anyone have any first-hand experience with current
> 21+ inch CRTs that they can share?
>
> Thanks,
> James
BTW, the NEC LCD2010X is a 20.1" LCD display with a native 1280x1024
resolution. Again, here're the specs of the unit:
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.necmitsubishi.com/products/home/DetailedSpecs.cfm?product_id=156&division=NEC" target="_blank">http://www.necmitsubishi.com/products/home/DetailedSpecs.cfm?product_i...56&divi</a>
Betelgeuse,
Armpit of the Giant
=============================================
"I Am Become Death, The Destroyer Of Worlds!"
=============================================
betelg [ at ] cogeco [ dot ] ca<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Sep 08, 2004
Posts: 9
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Sat Aug 16, 2003 11:37 pm
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"James Kilton" <kilton9.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:212002a7.0308161035.44881555@posting.google.com...
> Ok, so I think my dream of a 20-21 inch LCD is dying because they all
> seem to have a native resolution of 1600X1200 and that's too small for
> me. So I'm looking at CRT's once again and am wondering what the best
> flat screens are these days. I rarely play games so I think text
> quality is more important to me, and I've heard conflicting reports on
> whether or not Trinitrons are better than shadow masks in this regard.
>
> I was looking at the G220fb though I've seen complaints here about
> blurry text. Does anyone have any first-hand experience with current
> 21+ inch CRTs that they can share?
Is price an issue? If not, check this out: <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://tinyurl.com/k8bo." target="_blank">http://tinyurl.com/k8bo.</a>
2048 x 1536 @ 85Hz, .22mm pitch aperture grill across the whole
flat screen, etc., etc. You can find it a little cheaper if you shop
around, of course, but it's still about the most expensive 21" CRT mon-
itor you can find. And I haven't priced comparable LCD monitors, so
it could be quite competitively priced, compared to those. Bottom line-
it's about the best quality CRT monitor you're going to find, it's expen-
sive, and it's damn well worth it 
-Marshall<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Sep 08, 2004
Posts: 9
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Sun Aug 17, 2003 12:19 am
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Marshall" <Marshall RemoveThis @nospam.com> wrote in message
news:aCw%a.5630$Nf3.4739@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>
> "James Kilton" <kilton9 RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:212002a7.0308161035.44881555@posting.google.com...
> > Ok, so I think my dream of a 20-21 inch LCD is dying because they all
> > seem to have a native resolution of 1600X1200 and that's too small for
> > me. So I'm looking at CRT's once again and am wondering what the best
> > flat screens are these days. I rarely play games so I think text
> > quality is more important to me, and I've heard conflicting reports on
> > whether or not Trinitrons are better than shadow masks in this regard.
> >
> > I was looking at the G220fb though I've seen complaints here about
> > blurry text. Does anyone have any first-hand experience with current
> > 21+ inch CRTs that they can share?
>
<font color=purple> > Is price an issue? If not, check this out: <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://tinyurl.com/k8bo.</font" target="_blank">http://tinyurl.com/k8bo.</font</a>>
> 2048 x 1536 @ 85Hz, .22mm pitch aperture grill across the whole
> flat screen, etc., etc. You can find it a little cheaper if you shop
> around, of course, but it's still about the most expensive 21" CRT mon-
> itor you can find. And I haven't priced comparable LCD monitors, so
> it could be quite competitively priced, compared to those. Bottom line-
> it's about the best quality CRT monitor you're going to find, it's expen-
> sive, and it's damn well worth it
> -Marshall
Um, sorry, I think I may have initially misunderstood what you were
asking for... I thought you were looking for CRT monitors with higher
resolutions than 1600x1200- but after re-reading, I gather you meant
the opposite. Although, I can guarantee that this monitor will look
drop-dead gorgeous at 1280x1024 or 1024x768, as well.
-Marshall<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Nov 12, 2003
Posts: 649
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2003 8:00 pm
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On 16 Aug 2003 11:35:25 -0700, kilton9 RemoveThis @yahoo.com (James Kilton) wrote:
>Ok, so I think my dream of a 20-21 inch LCD is dying because they all
>seem to have a native resolution of 1600X1200 and that's too small for
>me.
I'm worried that we will all be facing this dilemma a few years from
now, when the big CRT's effectively go away. I also like to run my
21" at 1280x960, and sometimes even 1152x864 when I'm leaning waayyyy
back. 
Are we all doomed to squint at super-fine-pitch LCD's?<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Jun 30, 2003
Posts: 34
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2003 8:00 pm
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"chrisv" <chrisv.DeleteThis@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
news:rll4kvo4u8030fhs5polcrb3r7r0mknvit@4ax.com...
>
> Are we all doomed to squint at super-fine-pitch LCD's?
>
Eventually, yes. But don't forget that scaling is getting better
all the time, and there are also different LCD pixel layouts, etc.,
that are possible that will make the image appearance much more
"CRT-like" in the case of a lower-format image being displayed
on a fine-pitch LCD. After all, what's really the difference
between displaying a given image on a fine-pitch CRT vs. a
fine-pitch LCD - if, say, the LCD permitted subpixel addressing?
Bob M.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Nov 17, 2003
Posts: 4
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2003 11:43 pm
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In article <3f426865$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com>,
nospamplease RemoveThis @addressinvalid.com says...
> Eventually, yes. But don't forget that scaling is getting better
> all the time, and there are also different LCD pixel layouts, etc.,
> that are possible that will make the image appearance much more
> "CRT-like" in the case of a lower-format image being displayed
> on a fine-pitch LCD. After all, what's really the difference
> between displaying a given image on a fine-pitch CRT vs. a
> fine-pitch LCD - if, say, the LCD permitted subpixel addressing?
When will that day come? And, will it come later than when CRTs
finally get in such limited supply that their prices go up dramatically?
--
----------------------------------------
Paul Tiseo, Systems Programmer
Research Computing Facility, Mayo Clinic
tiseo128.paul23 RemoveThis @mayo.edu
(please remove numbers to email me)<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Nov 08, 2003
Posts: 160
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 2:50 am
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Thu, 21 Aug 2003 03:12:05 GMT
Dennis Roark <denro.TakeThisOut@NSPAMearthlink.net> wrote:
> chrisv <chrisv.TakeThisOut@nospam.invalid> wrote in
> news:rll4kvo4u8030fhs5polcrb3r7r0mknvit@4ax.com:
>
> > On 16 Aug 2003 11:35:25 -0700, kilton9.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com (James Kilton)
> > wrote:
> >
> >>Ok, so I think my dream of a 20-21 inch LCD is dying because they
> >all>seem to have a native resolution of 1600X1200 and that's too
> >small for>me.
> >
> > I'm worried that we will all be facing this dilemma a few years from
> > now, when the big CRT's effectively go away.
> >
> > Are we all doomed to squint at super-fine-pitch LCD's?
> >
>
> How much does it help on an LCD to go into Display Properties /
> Appearance / Font Size and change from normal to Large fonts? I worry
> about having to switch to LCD's as well and just hope the change to
> large fonts in the operating system will help. Anyone try this?
It helps the readability but Windows and Windows applications do not
deal gracefully with the large fonts. Try it on whatever you're running
now and see what happens.
--
--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Jun 28, 2003
Posts: 11
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 6:12 am
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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chrisv <chrisv.TakeThisOut@nospam.invalid> wrote in
news:rll4kvo4u8030fhs5polcrb3r7r0mknvit@4ax.com:
> On 16 Aug 2003 11:35:25 -0700, kilton9.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com (James Kilton) wrote:
>
>>Ok, so I think my dream of a 20-21 inch LCD is dying because they all
>>seem to have a native resolution of 1600X1200 and that's too small for
>>me.
>
> I'm worried that we will all be facing this dilemma a few years from
> now, when the big CRT's effectively go away.
>
> Are we all doomed to squint at super-fine-pitch LCD's?
>
How much does it help on an LCD to go into Display Properties / Appearance
/ Font Size and change from normal to Large fonts? I worry about having
to switch to LCD's as well and just hope the change to large fonts in the
operating system will help. Anyone try this?<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Jun 30, 2003
Posts: 34
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(Msg. 12) Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 2:51 pm
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Paul Tiseo" <tiseo128.paul23.DeleteThis@mayo.edu> wrote in message
news:MPG.19ada7d37a2df2ed9896ab@news.easynews.com...
> When will that day come? And, will it come later than when CRTs
> finally get in such limited supply that their prices go up dramatically?
>
LCDs with different layouts, sub-pixel addressing, etc.,
have already been developed - there's just little demand for such
things, vs. their cost, in the mainstream monitor market. Expect them
to show up first in the LCD TV products, where going for a more
"CRT-like" look is more important. In terms of CRT prices going
UP dramatically - I don't think you'll ever see that happen. My
guess is that by the time the last CRT rolls off its assembly line,
there will be little or no demand left for them. Now, as to
exactly when that "last CRT" comes to pass is another question...
Certainly, in the smaller (monitor) sizes, we can start to make some
predictions as to when it will be, but it's way early to call the CRT
overall "dead:, due to its continued dominance of the 25-40" TV
market.
Bob M.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Nov 17, 2003
Posts: 4
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(Msg. 13) Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2003 11:27 pm
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In article <3f450ceb$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com>,
nospamplease DeleteThis @addressinvalid.com says...
> Certainly, in the smaller (monitor) sizes, we can start to make some
> predictions as to when it will be, but it's way early to call the CRT
> overall "dead:, due to its continued dominance of the 25-40" TV
> market.
Thanks. You are obviously knowledgeable about the industry and
your insight/input is appreciated.
----------------------------------------
Paul Tiseo, Systems Programmer
Research Computing Facility, Mayo Clinic
tiseo128.paul23 DeleteThis @mayo.edu
(please remove numbers to email me)<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Oct 02, 2003
Posts: 28
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(Msg. 14) Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2003 4:13 am
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Too true. I have very crap vision (and I do wear glasses, but they don't
make my vision perfect), and I find 17 inch LCD's on the small side for
text. I up the text font size 150 percent and use larger fonts, but Windows
doesn't really like working with larger resolutions. My hope is the next
version of Windows is designed better for higher resolutions. Basicly, the
current version of Windows only looks best at 800X600, which is rapidly
becomming a technologically outdated resolution. Pictures, video, and
games demand higher resolutions to lower the number of aliasing artifacts
and increase clarity, but text really doesn't require it, and it can look
better in lower resolution because most letters are a bit "blocky" to start
with.
Also, when 1600X1200 LCD's/OLED's at 20 inches get cheap, I'm going to buy
one. It should scale nicely to 800X600, too. >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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External
Since: Nov 12, 2003
Posts: 649
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(Msg. 15) Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2003 5:56 pm
Post subject: Re: 21+ inch CRTs [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Tue, 26 Aug 2003 01:13:06 -0400, "magnulus"
<magnulus.TakeThisOut@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> Too true. I have very crap vision (and I do wear glasses, but they don't
>make my vision perfect), and I find 17 inch LCD's on the small side for
>text. I up the text font size 150 percent and use larger fonts, but Windows
>doesn't really like working with larger resolutions. My hope is the next
>version of Windows is designed better for higher resolutions. Basicly, the
>current version of Windows only looks best at 800X600, which is rapidly
>becomming a technologically outdated resolution. Pictures, video, and
>games demand higher resolutions to lower the number of aliasing artifacts
>and increase clarity, but text really doesn't require it, and it can look
>better in lower resolution because most letters are a bit "blocky" to start
>with.
>
> Also, when 1600X1200 LCD's/OLED's at 20 inches get cheap, I'm going to buy
>one. It should scale nicely to 800X600, too.
Yes it would scale nicely to 800x600. As you say, though, 800x600
isn't exactly where the world is going.<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ --> >> Stay informed about: 21+ inch CRTs |
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