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Gibby

External


Since: Dec 07, 2003
Posts: 22



(Msg. 1) Posted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 6:14 pm
Post subject: K6-III/450 PLUS + CPU Success/Failure stories
Archived from groups: alt>comp>periphs>mainboard>fic (more info?)
I'm starting this post hoping to hear accounts from people that have
installed the K6-III/450 + Plus CPU in the FIC PA-2013 MB. Even if you
don't have a personal story, perhaps, you can relate an account that
you have seen elsewhere.
I'm not so much talking about overclocking as well as determining
whether the JI4333 BIOS patch works properly to support the K6-III/450
plus CPU. Hoping to get lots of responses.
Thanks, Gibby

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Tim28

External


Since: Oct 09, 2003
Posts: 22



(Msg. 2) Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2003 4:08 am
Post subject: Re: K6-III/450 PLUS + CPU Success/Failure stories [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
MrBaltimore.RemoveThis@yahoo.com (Gibby) wrote in message news:<fc82565.0312141514.620e8b7d.RemoveThis@posting.google.com>...

 > I'm starting this post hoping to hear accounts from people that have
 > installed the K6-III/450 + Plus CPU in the FIC PA-2013 MB. Even if you
 > don't have a personal story, perhaps, you can relate an account that
 > you have seen elsewhere.
 > I'm not so much talking about overclocking as well as determining
 > whether the JI4333 BIOS patch works properly to support the K6-III/450
 > plus CPU. Hoping to get lots of responses.
 > Thanks, Gibby


Just a few....


From: Tim (tbennett@usit.net)
Subject: Re: Anyone ever get a PA-2013 to run a K6-3+ ???
Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
Date: 2001-02-24 21:23:23 PST

Baldy wrote:
 >
 > I don't recall reading anywhere why a PA2013 rev 2.0 board will not
 > run with a K6-III+. Anyone else out there ever try it sucessfully?


I've got that board running the K6-3 450+ @ 600mhz 2.0v. It was just
like setting up the 503+ board.

-------------------------------

From: Jerry (racer7201@earthlink.net)
Subject: Re: PA2013 Rev. 2.0 with K6-2+ or K6-III+?
Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
Date: 2000-10-10 12:59:41 PST

I can answer a couple questions. I just put the PA 2013 rev2.0 in yesterday to
replace my 503+ that had a bad dimm bank. I was also running the K6-2/550. I
had to flash the bios to JI4330 for it to recognize it and work. I currently
have it set at 550 with 2.1v.

--------------------------------

From: Colin L. Whipple (colinwMPSN@power.net)
Subject: Re: PA2013 Rev. 2.0 with K6-2+ or K6-III+?
Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
Date: 2000-10-10 16:52:09 PST

My K6-III+ came today. I have a PCB 2.0 mobo.

The flash bios upgrade to JI4330 went well, and my system is running at
500Mhz, 2.0 Volts.

---------------------------------

From: Robert A. Barr (rbarr12@prodigy.net)
Subject: K6-III+ on a PA-2013
Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
Date: 2000-10-06 20:14:10 PST

The flash to the 4330 BIOS was uneventful, and the new BIOS seems to
speed up the IDE detection at bootup; there's also some difference at
shutdown which I'll discuss later, but which might be very important for
people with IBM 75GXP hard drives.

I didn't even bother testing it at 450 -- why? It'll never stay
there...

@500: CPUMark = 54.1 2.0v core.
@550: CPUMark = 58.4 2.0v core.

This displayed some instability after running for about half an hour;
Netscape got cranky. I upped the voltage to 2.1, and that's as high as
I'm going. At 2.1 volts, everything is stable.

-----------------------------------

From: Brad Soe (bsoe@pacbell.net)
Subject: Re: Can't install an AMD k6-3 450+ in FIC PA 2013. Help!!
Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
Date: 2000-10-24 11:26:14 PST

Upgrading the BIOS did it. I am currently running at 5x112 (~550Mhz) using NT 4
without any problems yet!! This is amazing!

------------------------------------

From: Patrick Boehm (Feedguy1@home.com)
Subject: Re: Fic pa 2013 and beta bios to support k63+ cpu's
Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
Date: 2000-12-13 19:11:16 PST


Guess what! Got the 450 k63+ going at 550 mhz, 2.1 volts. Using standard
heatsink and fan. Let you know if it lasts a day. Smile Bios version ji4330.

-------------------------------------<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->

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Gibby

External


Since: Dec 07, 2003
Posts: 22



(Msg. 3) Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2003 9:39 am
Post subject: Re: K6-III/450 PLUS + CPU Success/Failure stories [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
Thanks Tim for the post - always informative. Everybody references the
Bios JI4330 as the one to use, but I've been on sites that say to use
the beta bios JI4333.zip for PA=2013 and JE4333.zip for VA503+. So,
I'm not sure which one to use.
See the following link for specs:
<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm" target="_blank">http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm</a>

What say you (and others)?
Thanks, Gibby
*********************************************************

tcsenter.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com (Tim) wrote in message news:<47a7af07.0312150108.79d294e3.TakeThisOut@posting.google.com>...
 > MrBaltimore.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com (Gibby) wrote in message news:<fc82565.0312141514.620e8b7d.TakeThisOut@posting.google.com>...
 >
  > > I'm starting this post hoping to hear accounts from people that have
  > > installed the K6-III/450 + Plus CPU in the FIC PA-2013 MB. Even if you
  > > don't have a personal story, perhaps, you can relate an account that
  > > you have seen elsewhere.
  > > I'm not so much talking about overclocking as well as determining
  > > whether the JI4333 BIOS patch works properly to support the K6-III/450
  > > plus CPU. Hoping to get lots of responses.
  > > Thanks, Gibby
 >
 >
 > Just a few....
 >
 >
 > From: Tim (tbennett@usit.net)
 > Subject: Re: Anyone ever get a PA-2013 to run a K6-3+ ???
 > Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
 > Date: 2001-02-24 21:23:23 PST
 >
 > Baldy wrote:
  > >
  > > I don't recall reading anywhere why a PA2013 rev 2.0 board will not
  > > run with a K6-III+. Anyone else out there ever try it sucessfully?
 >
 >
 > I've got that board running the K6-3 450+ @ 600mhz 2.0v. It was just
 > like setting up the 503+ board.
 >
 > -------------------------------
 >
 > From: Jerry (racer7201@earthlink.net)
 > Subject: Re: PA2013 Rev. 2.0 with K6-2+ or K6-III+?
 > Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
 > Date: 2000-10-10 12:59:41 PST
 >
 > I can answer a couple questions. I just put the PA 2013 rev2.0 in yesterday to
 > replace my 503+ that had a bad dimm bank. I was also running the K6-2/550. I
 > had to flash the bios to JI4330 for it to recognize it and work. I currently
 > have it set at 550 with 2.1v.
 >
 > --------------------------------
 >
 > From: Colin L. Whipple (colinwMPSN@power.net)
 > Subject: Re: PA2013 Rev. 2.0 with K6-2+ or K6-III+?
 > Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
 > Date: 2000-10-10 16:52:09 PST
 >
 > My K6-III+ came today. I have a PCB 2.0 mobo.
 >
 > The flash bios upgrade to JI4330 went well, and my system is running at
 > 500Mhz, 2.0 Volts.
 >
 > ---------------------------------
 >
 > From: Robert A. Barr (rbarr12@prodigy.net)
 > Subject: K6-III+ on a PA-2013
 > Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
 > Date: 2000-10-06 20:14:10 PST
 >
 > The flash to the 4330 BIOS was uneventful, and the new BIOS seems to
 > speed up the IDE detection at bootup; there's also some difference at
 > shutdown which I'll discuss later, but which might be very important for
 > people with IBM 75GXP hard drives.
 >
 > I didn't even bother testing it at 450 -- why? It'll never stay
 > there...
 >
 > @500: CPUMark = 54.1 2.0v core.
 > @550: CPUMark = 58.4 2.0v core.
 >
 > This displayed some instability after running for about half an hour;
 > Netscape got cranky. I upped the voltage to 2.1, and that's as high as
 > I'm going. At 2.1 volts, everything is stable.
 >
 > -----------------------------------
 >
 > From: Brad Soe (bsoe@pacbell.net)
 > Subject: Re: Can't install an AMD k6-3 450+ in FIC PA 2013. Help!!
 > Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
 > Date: 2000-10-24 11:26:14 PST
 >
 > Upgrading the BIOS did it. I am currently running at 5x112 (~550Mhz) using NT 4
 > without any problems yet!! This is amazing!
 >
 > ------------------------------------
 >
 > From: Patrick Boehm (Feedguy1@home.com)
 > Subject: Re: Fic pa 2013 and beta bios to support k63+ cpu's
 > Newsgroups: alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.fic
 > Date: 2000-12-13 19:11:16 PST
 >
 >
 > Guess what! Got the 450 k63+ going at 550 mhz, 2.1 volts. Using standard
 > heatsink and fan. Let you know if it lasts a day. Smile Bios version ji4330.
 >
 > -------------------------------------<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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Tim28

External


Since: Oct 09, 2003
Posts: 22



(Msg. 4) Posted: Mon Dec 15, 2003 10:39 pm
Post subject: Re: K6-III/450 PLUS + CPU Success/Failure stories [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
The reason most reference Jx4330 is because Jx4331 and Jx4333 had not
been released at the time or few people knew of them. These were
excerpted from discussions that are 3~4 years old. 4333 is the latest
in the 433x Series and is generally the better of the three due to the
improvements.

There is also an APM version for the PA-2013 based on JI4333:

<a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.geocities.com/tcsenter/ji4333apm.zip" target="_blank">http://www.geocities.com/tcsenter/ji4333apm.zip</a>

Right-click and choose 'Save As' or paste the address into a new
browser.

Regards,

Tim


MrBaltimore.DeleteThis@yahoo.com (Gibby) wrote in message news:<fc82565.0312150639.779a389a.DeleteThis@posting.google.com>...

 > Thanks Tim for the post - always informative. Everybody references the
 > Bios JI4330 as the one to use, but I've been on sites that say to use
 > the beta bios JI4333.zip for PA=2013 and JE4333.zip for VA503+. So,
 > I'm not sure which one to use.
 > See the following link for specs:
<font color=purple> > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm</font" target="_blank">http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm</font</a>>
 >
 > What say you (and others)?
 > Thanks, Gibby<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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Gibby

External


Since: Dec 07, 2003
Posts: 22



(Msg. 5) Posted: Tue Dec 16, 2003 3:23 pm
Post subject: Re: K6-III/450 PLUS + CPU Success/Failure stories [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
Tim: You are a wealth of information, indeed! I did hear from one
email that the person used Jx4333 with VA503+ and everything is going
well for 2 to 3 years. As far as APM version, what is APM? It will
likely come to me as soon as I press Post.
Thanks, Gibby
***************************************************

tcsenter RemoveThis @yahoo.com (Tim) wrote in message news:<47a7af07.0312151939.5a88d88f RemoveThis @posting.google.com>...
 > The reason most reference Jx4330 is because Jx4331 and Jx4333 had not
 > been released at the time or few people knew of them. These were
 > excerpted from discussions that are 3~4 years old. 4333 is the latest
 > in the 433x Series and is generally the better of the three due to the
 > improvements.
 >
 > There is also an APM version for the PA-2013 based on JI4333:
 >
<font color=purple> > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.geocities.com/tcsenter/ji4333apm.zip</font" target="_blank">http://www.geocities.com/tcsenter/ji4333apm.zip</font</a>>
 >
 > Right-click and choose 'Save As' or paste the address into a new
 > browser.
 >
 > Regards,
 >
 > Tim
 >
 >
 > MrBaltimore RemoveThis @yahoo.com (Gibby) wrote in message news:<fc82565.0312150639.779a389a RemoveThis @posting.google.com>...
 >
  > > Thanks Tim for the post - always informative. Everybody references the
  > > Bios JI4330 as the one to use, but I've been on sites that say to use
  > > the beta bios JI4333.zip for PA=2013 and JE4333.zip for VA503+. So,
  > > I'm not sure which one to use.
  > > See the following link for specs:
<font color=green>  > > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm</font" target="_blank">http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm</font</a>>
  > >
  > > What say you (and others)?
  > > Thanks, Gibby<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: K6-III/450 PLUS + CPU Success/Failure stories 
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Alex Zorrilla

External


Since: May 14, 2004
Posts: 181



(Msg. 6) Posted: Wed Dec 17, 2003 4:01 pm
Post subject: Re: K6-III/450 PLUS + CPU Success/Failure stories [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
APM (Advanced Power Management) is the power management scheme that predated ACPI. In addition to power,
ACPI also handles resource management, replacing Plug and Play. Some people have problems running their
computers with ACPI, often because of buggy drivers or OS support. The APM BIOS gives them the option to go
back to the "old" way of doing things.

--Alex


Gibby wrote:

 > Tim: You are a wealth of information, indeed! I did hear from one
 > email that the person used Jx4333 with VA503+ and everything is going
 > well for 2 to 3 years. As far as APM version, what is APM? It will
 > likely come to me as soon as I press Post.
 > Thanks, Gibby
 > ***************************************************
 >
 > tcsenter DeleteThis @yahoo.com (Tim) wrote in message news:<47a7af07.0312151939.5a88d88f DeleteThis @posting.google.com>...
  > > The reason most reference Jx4330 is because Jx4331 and Jx4333 had not
  > > been released at the time or few people knew of them. These were
  > > excerpted from discussions that are 3~4 years old. 4333 is the latest
  > > in the 433x Series and is generally the better of the three due to the
  > > improvements.
  > >
  > > There is also an APM version for the PA-2013 based on JI4333:
  > >
<font color=green>  > > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.geocities.com/tcsenter/ji4333apm.zip</font" target="_blank">http://www.geocities.com/tcsenter/ji4333apm.zip</font</a>>
  > >
  > > Right-click and choose 'Save As' or paste the address into a new
  > > browser.
  > >
  > > Regards,
  > >
  > > Tim
  > >
  > >
  > > MrBaltimore DeleteThis @yahoo.com (Gibby) wrote in message news:<fc82565.0312150639.779a389a DeleteThis @posting.google.com>...
  > >
   > > > Thanks Tim for the post - always informative. Everybody references the
   > > > Bios JI4330 as the one to use, but I've been on sites that say to use
   > > > the beta bios JI4333.zip for PA=2013 and JE4333.zip for VA503+. So,
   > > > I'm not sure which one to use.
   > > > See the following link for specs:
<font color=brown>   > > > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm</font" target="_blank">http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm</font</a>>
   > > >
   > > > What say you (and others)?
   > > > Thanks, Gibby<!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: K6-III/450 PLUS + CPU Success/Failure stories 
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Shadowman

External


Since: Nov 03, 2003
Posts: 3



(Msg. 7) Posted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 10:39 pm
Post subject: Re: K6-III/450 PLUS + CPU Success/Failure stories [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
FWIW, I've been using a 500 Mhz-rated K6-2+ in my PA-2013 for the last
three years or so, overclocked to 550 Mhz from the word go. The system has
been practically trouble-free and I've been v. happy with the performance,
all things considerd. It's not a K6-III+ but it's not far short in
performance, and was significantly easier and cheaper to obtain.
But despite using quality PC133 RAM, I could never get it stable at 600
Mhz or increase the RAM speed past 100.
My CPU99 benchmark score, tested as I write this, is 49.4.
For anybody who wants to stick with Socket 7, I'd recommend obtaining a
K6-2+. The 500 Mhz-rated ones were common and I've seen references to
550-rated examples...
The JI4333 BIOS works fine for me. And I have all the settings at their
most "aggressive".

"Alex Zorrilla" <apz.TakeThisOut@zxeng.com> wrote in message
news:3FE0A7F7.B981AF00@zxeng.com...
 > APM (Advanced Power Management) is the power management scheme that
predated ACPI. In addition to power,
 > ACPI also handles resource management, replacing Plug and Play. Some
people have problems running their
 > computers with ACPI, often because of buggy drivers or OS support. The
APM BIOS gives them the option to go
 > back to the "old" way of doing things.
 >
 > --Alex
 >
 >
 > Gibby wrote:
 >
  > > Tim: You are a wealth of information, indeed! I did hear from one
  > > email that the person used Jx4333 with VA503+ and everything is going
  > > well for 2 to 3 years. As far as APM version, what is APM? It will
  > > likely come to me as soon as I press Post.
  > > Thanks, Gibby
  > > ***************************************************
  > >
  > > tcsenter.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com (Tim) wrote in message
news:<47a7af07.0312151939.5a88d88f.TakeThisOut@posting.google.com>...
   > > > The reason most reference Jx4330 is because Jx4331 and Jx4333 had not
   > > > been released at the time or few people knew of them. These were
   > > > excerpted from discussions that are 3~4 years old. 4333 is the latest
   > > > in the 433x Series and is generally the better of the three due to the
   > > > improvements.
   > > >
   > > > There is also an APM version for the PA-2013 based on JI4333:
   > > >
<font color=brown>   > > > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.geocities.com/tcsenter/ji4333apm.zip</font" target="_blank">http://www.geocities.com/tcsenter/ji4333apm.zip</font</a>>
   > > >
   > > > Right-click and choose 'Save As' or paste the address into a new
   > > > browser.
   > > >
   > > > Regards,
   > > >
   > > > Tim
   > > >
   > > >
   > > > MrBaltimore.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com (Gibby) wrote in message
news:<fc82565.0312150639.779a389a.TakeThisOut@posting.google.com>...
   > > >
   > > > > Thanks Tim for the post - always informative. Everybody references
the
   > > > > Bios JI4330 as the one to use, but I've been on sites that say to
use
   > > > > the beta bios JI4333.zip for PA=2013 and JE4333.zip for VA503+. So,
   > > > > I'm not sure which one to use.
   > > > > See the following link for specs:
<font color=brown>   > > > > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm</font" target="_blank">http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm</font</a>>
   > > > >
   > > > > What say you (and others)?
   > > > > Thanks, Gibby
 ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
 >> Stay informed about: K6-III/450 PLUS + CPU Success/Failure stories 
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Gibby

External


Since: Dec 07, 2003
Posts: 22



(Msg. 8) Posted: Thu Dec 25, 2003 11:55 am
Post subject: Re: K6-III/450 PLUS + CPU Success/Failure stories [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
Just checking in to let everybody know that I have installed a
K6-III/450 + Mhz CPU on my PA-2013 using P133 Cas3 Crucial memory (all
3 slots) with the JI4333 Bios and everything seems to be working well.
I don't overclock like many others. Shadowman, what are your BIOS
"aggressive settings" on the Pa-2013? I'd be interested in what works
for you. Or is there a site that indicates these aggressive settings?
Gibby
*********************************************
"Shadowman" <michael.anders.TakeThisOut@attglobal.net> wrote in message news:<brvr2f$89cse$1@ID-26971.news.uni-berlin.de>...
 > FWIW, I've been using a 500 Mhz-rated K6-2+ in my PA-2013 for the last
 > three years or so, overclocked to 550 Mhz from the word go. The system has
 > been practically trouble-free and I've been v. happy with the performance,
 > all things considerd. It's not a K6-III+ but it's not far short in
 > performance, and was significantly easier and cheaper to obtain.
 > But despite using quality PC133 RAM, I could never get it stable at 600
 > Mhz or increase the RAM speed past 100.
 > My CPU99 benchmark score, tested as I write this, is 49.4.
 > For anybody who wants to stick with Socket 7, I'd recommend obtaining a
 > K6-2+. The 500 Mhz-rated ones were common and I've seen references to
 > 550-rated examples...
 > The JI4333 BIOS works fine for me. And I have all the settings at their
 > most "aggressive".
 >
 > "Alex Zorrilla" <apz.TakeThisOut@zxeng.com> wrote in message
 > news:3FE0A7F7.B981AF00@zxeng.com...
  > > APM (Advanced Power Management) is the power management scheme that
 > predated ACPI. In addition to power,
  > > ACPI also handles resource management, replacing Plug and Play. Some
 > people have problems running their
  > > computers with ACPI, often because of buggy drivers or OS support. The
 > APM BIOS gives them the option to go
  > > back to the "old" way of doing things.
  > >
  > > --Alex
  > >
  > >
  > > Gibby wrote:
  > >
   > > > Tim: You are a wealth of information, indeed! I did hear from one
   > > > email that the person used Jx4333 with VA503+ and everything is going
   > > > well for 2 to 3 years. As far as APM version, what is APM? It will
   > > > likely come to me as soon as I press Post.
   > > > Thanks, Gibby
   > > > ***************************************************
   > > >
   > > > tcsenter.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com (Tim) wrote in message
 > news:<47a7af07.0312151939.5a88d88f.TakeThisOut@posting.google.com>...
   > > > > The reason most reference Jx4330 is because Jx4331 and Jx4333 had not
   > > > > been released at the time or few people knew of them. These were
   > > > > excerpted from discussions that are 3~4 years old. 4333 is the latest
   > > > > in the 433x Series and is generally the better of the three due to the
   > > > > improvements.
   > > > >
   > > > > There is also an APM version for the PA-2013 based on JI4333:
   > > > >
<font color=brown>   > > > > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://www.geocities.com/tcsenter/ji4333apm.zip</font" target="_blank">http://www.geocities.com/tcsenter/ji4333apm.zip</font</a>>
   > > > >
   > > > > Right-click and choose 'Save As' or paste the address into a new
   > > > > browser.
   > > > >
   > > > > Regards,
   > > > >
   > > > > Tim
   > > > >
   > > > >
   > > > > MrBaltimore.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com (Gibby) wrote in message
 > news:<fc82565.0312150639.779a389a.TakeThisOut@posting.google.com>...
   > > > >
   > > > > > Thanks Tim for the post - always informative. Everybody references
 > the
   > > > > > Bios JI4330 as the one to use, but I've been on sites that say to
 > use
   > > > > > the beta bios JI4333.zip for PA=2013 and JE4333.zip for VA503+. So,
   > > > > > I'm not sure which one to use.
   > > > > > See the following link for specs:
<font color=brown>   > > > > > <a style='text-decoration: underline;' href="http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm</font" target="_blank">http://web.inter.nl.net/hcc/J.Steunebrink/k6plus.htm</font</a>>
   > > > > >
   > > > > > What say you (and others)?
   > > > > > Thanks, Gibby
  > ><!-- ~MESSAGE_AFTER~ -->
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