Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf

Crackles McFarly wrote:
> I had one of those Seagate 7200.10 320GB drive made in CHINA, it made
> that horrible CHIRP and other noises. I had it replaced, seagate sent
> me a 'refurbished' drive from SNIGAPORE and it works VERY WELL.
> Even benchmarks are 5%-10% BETTER!!???
>
> Seems odd that a REFURBISHED drive would work so much better than a
> new one.
>
> I think it's the fact that mine is now from SINGAPORE and not China. I
> heard some terrible stories about the drives made in China too.
>
>
> Oh well, I guess?

It's not particularly surprising, or even unusual.

1. Refurbished hard drives aren't repaired. They're just tested.
Typically, the testing is the same as for a new drive, or slightly more
stringent, as this same drive passed QC the first time it left the
factory. That means that either the refurb had nothing wrong with it
when it got returned, or the QC tests aren't good enough to catch
whatever was wrong with it. Either way, that means that aside from the
way shorter warranty, the refurb is as good as the new one -- which
isn't necessarily saying much.

2. Typically RMA policy for all the major manufacturers is to send out
the same model or a newer one that's as close in specs as the original,
if they don't have one in stock. When there's a shortage or issue with
a particular model, it's not unheard of for a company to send out a
better model.

3. Consider that the one you returned wasn't running at 100%. Before it
went down for the count, the problems were probably affecting its
performance. If the replacement *is* working properly, you're comparing
a drive working to spec, vs one that was having to compensate for bad
reads and writes.

-------------------------------
MCheu
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

In alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt Crackles McFarly
<IrelandSux.RemoveThis@ireland.sux> wrote:

>I had one of those Seagate 7200.10 320GB drive made in CHINA, it made
>that horrible CHIRP and other noises. I had it replaced, seagate sent
>me a 'refurbished' drive from SNIGAPORE and it works VERY WELL.
>Even benchmarks are 5%-10% BETTER!!???
>
>Seems odd that a REFURBISHED drive would work so much better than a
>new one.
>
No, not really.

>I think it's the fact that mine is now from SINGAPORE and not China. I
>heard some terrible stories about the drives made in China too.
>
Different factories just *do* things differently, in spite of the
company trying their damndest to make them run exactly alike.

Reminds me of the old story about moving the vacuum-tube business to
Russia ... Some tubes just would NOT work until they sent over the whole
team from the original company and got the line running right.

The specifications and even components just are NOT the drive.

--
_____
/ ' / ™
,-/-, __ __. ____ /_
(_/ / (_(_/|_/ / <_/ <_
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

"Crackles McFarly" <IrelandSux.RemoveThis@ireland.sux> wrote in message news:6v0ia3pk53cgq5lr5as8t063fdnj0urkvo@bbb.org
> I had one of those Seagate 7200.10 320GB drive made in CHINA, it made
> that horrible CHIRP and other noises. I had it replaced, seagate sent
> me a 'refurbished' drive from SNIGAPORE and it works VERY WELL.
> Even benchmarks are 5%-10% BETTER!!???

> Seems odd that a REFURBISHED drive would work so much better than a
> new one.

Oh, and why is that.

>
> I think it's the fact that mine is now from SINGAPORE and not China.

Of course, that's it. How clever of you.

Obviously the fact that the refurbished drive was tested extensively
before it was given the green flag and the "new one" wasn't has got
nothing to do with it.

> I heard some terrible stories about the drives made in China too.

And they are all true.
That's why all the major manufacturers make their drives there.

>
>
> Oh well, I guess?

Guessing makes your head hurt.
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

"MCheu" <mpcheu DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote in message news:K-mdnU6iy8K3jzTbnZ2dnUVZ_uuqnZ2d@golden.net
> Crackles McFarly wrote:
> > I had one of those Seagate 7200.10 320GB drive made in CHINA, it made
> > that horrible CHIRP and other noises. I had it replaced, seagate sent
> > me a 'refurbished' drive from SNIGAPORE and it works VERY WELL.
> > Even benchmarks are 5%-10% BETTER!!???
> >
> > Seems odd that a REFURBISHED drive would work so much better than a
> > new one.
> >
> > I think it's the fact that mine is now from SINGAPORE and not China.
> > I heard some terrible stories about the drives made in China too.
> >
> >
> > Oh well, I guess?
>
> It's not particularly surprising, or even unusual.

> 1. Refurbished hard drives aren't repaired.

Oh? You're saying that they lie?
(Not to say that refurbished necessarily means 'repaired').

> They're just tested.

They're that too.

> Typically, the testing is the same as for a new drive,

Not very likely.

> or slightly more stringent,

> as this same drive passed QC the first time it left the factory.

> That means that either the refurb had nothing wrong with it
> when it got returned, or the QC tests aren't good enough to catch
> whatever was wrong with it.

> Either way, that means that aside from the way shorter warranty,

Actually, the warranty period is exactly the same as for the one
that you returned. It's transferred to the refurbished drive.

> the refurb is as good as the new one --

Hopefully not.

> which isn't necessarily saying much.

Exactly.

>
> 2. Typically RMA policy for all the major manufacturers is to send out
> the same model or a newer one that's as close in specs as the original, if
> they don't have one in stock. When there's a shortage or issue with a par-
ticular model, it's not unheard of for a company to send out a better model.
>
> 3. Consider that the one you returned wasn't running at 100%. Before it
> went down for the count, the problems were probably affecting its
> performance. If the replacement *is* working properly, you're comparing
> a drive working to spec, vs one that was having to compensate for bad
> reads and writes.
>
> -------------------------------
> MCheu
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

On Thu, 26 Jul 2007 15:56:50 -0700, isaac4all
<finditall100free RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:

>hi
>seagate SNIGAPORE is better than see gate CHINA.
>when we shop for Seagate hard drive, we do not purchase any other
>seagate hard drive that is not made in SNIGAPORE because accounding to
>our study seagate SNIGAPORE is more reliable and does not get damaged
>has made in china does. we have used a seagate hard drive made in
>SNIGAPORE for 6 years 3 monrh now without any problems. wither the
>hard drive is refurbished or not made in SNIGAPORE is far better than
>made in china
>
>
>isaac okoye
>information rules the world
>www.finditall100free.ds4a.com/Shopping.htm

Almost everything made in china is garbage these days.
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

On Thu, 26 Jul 2007 16:31:38 -0400, Crackles McFarly
<IrelandSux.RemoveThis@ireland.sux> wrote:

>I had one of those Seagate 7200.10 320GB drive made in CHINA, it made
>that horrible CHIRP and other noises. I had it replaced, seagate sent
>me a 'refurbished' drive from SNIGAPORE and it works VERY WELL.
>Even benchmarks are 5%-10% BETTER!!???
>
>Seems odd that a REFURBISHED drive would work so much better than a
>new one.
>
>I think it's the fact that mine is now from SINGAPORE and not China. I
>heard some terrible stories about the drives made in China too.
>
>
>Oh well, I guess?


You have a sample size of one each. Realize what that
means.
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

On Fri, 27 Jul 2007 01:04:13 +0200, "Folkert Rienstra"
<see_reply-to.RemoveThis@myweb.nl> put finger to keyboard and composed:

>Actually, the warranty period is exactly the same as for the one
>that you returned. It's transferred to the refurbished drive.

In 2003 or 2004 I purchased a Seagate ST3120026A drive with either a 2
or 3 year warranty which would have expired in Aug 2006. About a year
later (Jan 2005) I received an identical replacement with a 5 year
warranty that expires in Dec 2009, ie the new warranty is for the full
5 years, not 5 - 1.

Has Seagate's policy changed since then?

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

isaac4all wrote:
> hi
> seagate SNIGAPORE is better than see gate CHINA.
> when we shop for Seagate hard drive, we do not purchase any other
> seagate hard drive that is not made in SNIGAPORE because accounding to
> our study seagate SNIGAPORE is more reliable and does not get damaged
> has made in china does. we have used a seagate hard drive made in
> SNIGAPORE for 6 years 3 monrh now without any problems. wither the
> hard drive is refurbished or not made in SNIGAPORE is far better than
> made in china
>
>
> isaac okoye
> information rules the world
> www.finditall100free.ds4a.com/Shopping.htm
>

Well now that you have fixed your hard drive problems you should
concentrate on your broken keyboard.
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar.DeleteThis@iinternode.on.net> wrote in message news:f1bja39qutqiap11g9b6cf3lqam5p8fb87@4ax.com
> On Fri, 27 Jul 2007 01:04:13 +0200, "Folkert Rienstra" <see_reply-to.DeleteThis@myweb.nl> put finger to keyboard and composed:
>
> > Actually, the warranty period is exactly the same as for the one
> > that you returned. It's transferred to the refurbished drive.

> In 2003 or 2004 I purchased a Seagate ST3120026A drive with either a 2
> or 3 year warranty which would have expired in Aug 2006.

You make little sense.

> About a year later (Jan 2005) I received an identical replacement with
> a 5 year warranty that expires in Dec 2009, ie the new warranty is for
> the full 5 years,

> not 5 - 1.

What's with the minus 1? You had 19 months of warranty left.
That should have been the new warranty on your replacement drive.
Otherwise you would be able to extend your warranty forever, every
time you break your drive and send it in for warranty.

>
> Has Seagate's policy changed since then?
(what makes you think that that was policy?)

You mean, did Seagate give you a lifelong warranty on your drives?
What do you think. I think you got extremely lucky.

>
> - Franc Zabkar
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

On Thu, 26 Jul 2007 17:29:14 -0400, MCheu <mpcheu.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> put
finger to keyboard and composed:

>1. Refurbished hard drives aren't repaired. They're just tested.
>Typically, the testing is the same as for a new drive, or slightly more
>stringent, as this same drive passed QC the first time it left the
>factory. That means that either the refurb had nothing wrong with it
>when it got returned, or the QC tests aren't good enough to catch
>whatever was wrong with it. Either way, that means that aside from the
>way shorter warranty, ...

I'd confirm the warranty status of the replacement drive here:
http://support.seagate.com/customer/warranty_validation.jsp

> ... the refurb is as good as the new one

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

On Sat, 28 Jul 2007 09:12:54 +0200, "Folkert Rienstra"
<see_reply-to RemoveThis @myweb.nl> put finger to keyboard and composed:

>"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar RemoveThis @iinternode.on.net> wrote in message news:f1bja39qutqiap11g9b6cf3lqam5p8fb87@4ax.com
>> On Fri, 27 Jul 2007 01:04:13 +0200, "Folkert Rienstra" <see_reply-to RemoveThis @myweb.nl> put finger to keyboard and composed:
>>
>> > Actually, the warranty period is exactly the same as for the one
>> > that you returned. It's transferred to the refurbished drive.
>
>> In 2003 or 2004 I purchased a Seagate ST3120026A drive with either a 2
>> or 3 year warranty which would have expired in Aug 2006.
>
>You make little sense.

It means that I can't remember whether I bought the drive in 2003 or
2004. Neither can I remember whether the warranty was for 2 or 3
years. But I know for certain that the warranty was valid until Aug
2006 (it's on my RMA), and I know that I had the drive for about a
year.

>> About a year later (Jan 2005) I received an identical replacement with
>> a 5 year warranty that expires in Dec 2009, ie the new warranty is for
>> the full 5 years,
>
>> not 5 - 1.
>
>What's with the minus 1? You had 19 months of warranty left.
>That should have been the new warranty on your replacement drive.
>Otherwise you would be able to extend your warranty forever, every
>time you break your drive and send it in for warranty.

That's what happened. As I plainly stated, my new drive came with a
full 5 year warranty. Seagate's warranty URL confirms this:

http://support.seagate.com/customer/warranty_validation.jsp

>> Has Seagate's policy changed since then?
>(what makes you think that that was policy?)
>
>You mean, did Seagate give you a lifelong warranty on your drives?

Such a practice is not uncommon in retail, especially when a product
is exchanged, rather than repaired.

For example, I recently had a DVD recorder fail after about 10 months
(actually it failed much earlier, but I persisted with it until then).
I eventually returned it to the store (Aldi) and was given a full
refund even though I asked for it to be repaired. In fact I would have
repaired it myself if they'd have reimbursed me for the parts (a $50
IDE DVD burner). Anyway with the refund I was able to purchase a newer
model from the same store for the same price ... with a full warranty.

>What do you think. I think you got extremely lucky.
>
>>
>> - Franc Zabkar

Maybe, but that's what happened. I don't make the rules.

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar.RemoveThis@iinternode.on.net> wrote in message news:ngdna3p8sq3k8a8ducn72r9tddieunc8ar@4ax.com
> On Sat, 28 Jul 2007 09:12:54 +0200, "Folkert Rienstra" <see_reply-to.RemoveThis@myweb.nl> put finger to keyboard and composed:
> > "Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar.RemoveThis@iinternode.on.net> wrote in message news:f1bja39qutqiap11g9b6cf3lqam5p8fb87@4ax.com
> > > On Fri, 27 Jul 2007 01:04:13 +0200, "Folkert Rienstra" <see_reply-to.RemoveThis@myweb.nl> put finger to keyboard and composed:
> > >
> > > > Actually, the warranty period is exactly the same as for the one
> > > > that you returned. It's transferred to the refurbished drive.
> >
> > > In 2003 or 2004 I purchased a Seagate ST3120026A drive with either a 2
> > > or 3 year warranty which would have expired in Aug 2006.
> >
> > You make little sense.
>
> It means that I can't remember whether I bought the drive in 2003 or
> 2004.

You mean whether it was end 2003 or early 2004.

> Neither can I remember whether the warranty was for 2 or 3 years.

Usually 3. Either that or 1 year. Which probably means that your's
was on the shelves for 3-4 months since manufacturing Aug 2003.

> But I know for certain that the warranty was valid until Aug 2006
> (it's on my RMA),

> and I know that I had the drive for about a year.

So it's rather clear when you bought it (give or take a few months).

>
> > > About a year later (Jan 2005) I received an identical replacement with
> > > a 5 year warranty that expires in Dec 2009, ie the new warranty is for
> > > the full 5 years,
> >
> > > not 5 - 1.
> >
> > What's with the minus 1? You had 19 months of warranty left.
> > That should have been the new warranty on your replacement drive.
> > Otherwise you would be able to extend your warranty forever, every
> > time you break your drive and send it in for warranty.
>
> That's what happened.

> As I plainly stated, my new drive came with a full 5 year warranty.

Yes, I got that. Now for *my* question, what's with the minus 1.

> Seagate's warranty URL confirms this:
> http://support.seagate.com/customer/warranty_validation.jsp

Did I say that I didn't believe you?

>
> > > Has Seagate's policy changed since then?
> > (what makes you think that that was policy?)
> >
> > You mean, did Seagate give you a lifelong warranty on your drives?

> Such a practice is not uncommon in retail,

AFAICT Seagate don't have a WebShop.

> especially when a product is exchanged, rather than repaired.

At which time it's not uncommon that you are asked to make payment
for the time that you were able to use it (using depreciation rules).

>
> For example, I recently had a DVD recorder fail after about 10 months
> (actually it failed much earlier, but I persisted with it until then).
> I eventually returned it to the store (Aldi) and was given a full
> refund even though I asked for it to be repaired. In fact I would have
> repaired it myself if they'd have reimbursed me for the parts (a $50
> IDE DVD burner). Anyway with the refund I was able to purchase a newer
> model from the same store for the same price ... with a full warranty.

Aldi eh, such a common example of a computer store, what can I say ....
you're totally right.

>
> > What do you think. I think you got extremely lucky.
> >
> > >
> > > - Franc Zabkar
>
> Maybe, but that's what happened.

> I don't make the rules.

Yup, I believe that is what 'being lucky' means.

>
> - Franc Zabkar
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf 

On Mon, 30 Jul 2007 17:56:02 +0200, "Folkert Rienstra"
<see_reply-to RemoveThis @myweb.nl> put finger to keyboard and composed:

>"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar RemoveThis @iinternode.on.net> wrote in message news:ngdna3p8sq3k8a8ducn72r9tddieunc8ar@4ax.com
>> On Sat, 28 Jul 2007 09:12:54 +0200, "Folkert Rienstra" <see_reply-to RemoveThis @myweb.nl> put finger to keyboard and composed:
>> > "Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar RemoveThis @iinternode.on.net> wrote in message news:f1bja39qutqiap11g9b6cf3lqam5p8fb87@4ax.com
>> > > On Fri, 27 Jul 2007 01:04:13 +0200, "Folkert Rienstra" <see_reply-to RemoveThis @myweb.nl> put finger to keyboard and composed:
>> > >
>> > > > Actually, the warranty period is exactly the same as for the one
>> > > > that you returned. It's transferred to the refurbished drive.
>> >
>> > > In 2003 or 2004 I purchased a Seagate ST3120026A drive with either a 2
>> > > or 3 year warranty which would have expired in Aug 2006.
>> >
>> > You make little sense.
>>
>> It means that I can't remember whether I bought the drive in 2003 or
>> 2004.
>
>You mean whether it was end 2003 or early 2004.
>
>> Neither can I remember whether the warranty was for 2 or 3 years.
>
>Usually 3. Either that or 1 year. Which probably means that your's
>was on the shelves for 3-4 months since manufacturing Aug 2003.

Yeah, IIRC there was a period where most HD manufacturers (except
Samsung?) dropped their warranties to 1 year.

>> But I know for certain that the warranty was valid until Aug 2006
>> (it's on my RMA),
>
>> and I know that I had the drive for about a year.
>
>So it's rather clear when you bought it (give or take a few months).
>
>>
>> > > About a year later (Jan 2005) I received an identical replacement with
>> > > a 5 year warranty that expires in Dec 2009, ie the new warranty is for
>> > > the full 5 years,
>> >
>> > > not 5 - 1.
>> >
>> > What's with the minus 1? You had 19 months of warranty left.
>> > That should have been the new warranty on your replacement drive.
>> > Otherwise you would be able to extend your warranty forever, every
>> > time you break your drive and send it in for warranty.

I would have expected that the new warranty would have been reduced by
a year or so. Whether this amounted to 3-1 or 5-1 is moot. The fact is
that the new warranty wasn't reduced at all, instead it was increased.

I don't care why it happened this way, it just did. End of story.

>> That's what happened.
>
>> As I plainly stated, my new drive came with a full 5 year warranty.
>
>Yes, I got that. Now for *my* question, what's with the minus 1.

Why are you being deliberately obtuse?

>> Seagate's warranty URL confirms this:
>> http://support.seagate.com/customer/warranty_validation.jsp
>
>Did I say that I didn't believe you?

Did I say that you said that I didn't believe you?

>> > > Has Seagate's policy changed since then?
>> > (what makes you think that that was policy?)
>> >
>> > You mean, did Seagate give you a lifelong warranty on your drives?
>
>> Such a practice is not uncommon in retail,
>
>AFAICT Seagate don't have a WebShop.

Your point being ???

>> especially when a product is exchanged, rather than repaired.
>
>At which time it's not uncommon that you are asked to make payment
>for the time that you were able to use it (using depreciation rules).

I don't recall this ever happening to me.

>> For example, I recently had a DVD recorder fail after about 10 months
>> (actually it failed much earlier, but I persisted with it until then).
>> I eventually returned it to the store (Aldi) and was given a full
>> refund even though I asked for it to be repaired. In fact I would have
>> repaired it myself if they'd have reimbursed me for the parts (a $50
>> IDE DVD burner). Anyway with the refund I was able to purchase a newer
>> model from the same store for the same price ... with a full warranty.
>
>Aldi eh, such a common example of a computer store, ...

I didn't buy a computer from them. In any case it's irrelevant to the
point I was making, but you knew that.

>what can I say ....
>you're totally right.

Of course.

>> > What do you think. I think you got extremely lucky.
>> >
>> > >
>> > > - Franc Zabkar
>>
>> Maybe, but that's what happened.
>
>> I don't make the rules.
>
>Yup, I believe that is what 'being lucky' means.

I'd be interested to know if the OP also "got lucky". Then again,
maybe we just get better service down under.

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
 >> Stay informed about: Reburbished drive is BETTER than the NEW ONE?? wtf