S1590 with AGP8x?

Paul wrote:
>
> There is some info here.
>
> http://www.playtool.com/pages/agpcompat/agp.html

Thanks for this link. I will have to read through this page more carefully.

> Working backwards using the new video card ID, the MX4000 is a
> "Universal AGP 3.0 Card". It works at 3.3V or 1.5V.
>
> Basically, if the card can be fitted into the AGP socket, it
> should be OK. I can find different images for the MX4000, and
> the example here, has both the 1.5V and 3.3V slots cut. This
> card should plug into any AGP slot.
>
> http://www.eyeswatching.com/Assets/product_images/K078MX4000-T128-80.jpg
>

Here's a link to MSI's page on this card, http://tinyurl.com/2xrpem. This
link shows a larger image, http://tinyurl.com/2bpdy6. The exact model
number is 8936-550 with serial number B0408078346. It's the one with the
gold anodized heat sink in the photo on MSI's site. The card appears to
have both the 1.5v and 3.3v slots cut into it's connector.


> The other part of the equation, is the nature of the chipset. Some
> chipsets have more stable AGP interfaces than others. I learned that
> first hand, from an old ALI chipset. I don't know what chipset your
> S1590 uses. To make them stable, sometimes it requires reducing the
> AGP speed setting in the BIOS. In other cases, the BIOS will have
> "drive strength" settings for the AGP bus drivers on the Northbridge.

The S1590 uses the Via MVP3 chipset. My current configuration has been
running very smoothly since I built the computer almost 8 years ago. I sort
of hate to make major changes though it would be nice to have a better video
card to potentially play DVDs without any flicker. The machine has had an
upgraded power supply to a unit from PC Power & Cooling as well as a couple
of hard drive upgrades (currently running two 18GB U2W scsi drives, scsi
Teac CDRW and scsi Toshiba DVD), and additional memory. I have a scsi zip
drive as well but they've been made pretty much obsolete by the
proliferation of USB flash drives.


> The FTP files on the Tyan site are not archived, but you can dig up
> a bit of stuff for an old board, from web.archive.org . I expect
> a lot of the info here, is out of date and irrelevant.
>
> http://web.archive.org/web/20000517032907/www.tyan.com/support/html/s1..._agp_fa
> http://web.archive.org/web/20000517161056/http://www.tyan.com/support/...l/s1590
>

Thanks again for the links. I have a lot of this stuff printed out and
saved from when I put the machine together. I will have to dig through it
once more.

Eric
 >> Stay informed about: S1590 with AGP8x? 

hi ,

if this videocard isn't compatible with agp 1 or agp 2 ( which i doubt )
and it would fit into the slot , you even might destroy it .

In article <46A1B582.265C5727 DeleteThis @spam.now>, say.no DeleteThis @spam.now says...
> I have an old Tyan s1590 which is currently running a Voodoo III 3000. A
> friend of mine just gave me a video card as a potential candidate for an
> upgrade. It turns out that it's an MSI MX4000-T64. This is an AGP8x card.
> I'm not sure that this card would be compatible with the s1590's AGP slot.
> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Thanks, Eric
>

--
gravity is still active
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gruss , wolfgang
 >> Stay informed about: S1590 with AGP8x? 

wolfgang schneider wrote:
>
> hi ,
>
> if this videocard isn't compatible with agp 1 or agp 2 ( which i doubt )
> and it would fit into the slot , you even might destroy it .

Thanks for the reply. I'm not so concerned with damaging the video card,
I'm more concerned with damaging my motherboard. Please see my reply to
Paul's post regarding the slot connector and which also has links to MSI's
details of the card.

Thanks again, Eric
 >> Stay informed about: S1590 with AGP8x? 

Eric wrote:
> Paul wrote:
>> There is some info here.
>>
>> http://www.playtool.com/pages/agpcompat/agp.html
>
> Thanks for this link. I will have to read through this page more carefully.
>
>> Working backwards using the new video card ID, the MX4000 is a
>> "Universal AGP 3.0 Card". It works at 3.3V or 1.5V.
>>
>> Basically, if the card can be fitted into the AGP socket, it
>> should be OK. I can find different images for the MX4000, and
>> the example here, has both the 1.5V and 3.3V slots cut. This
>> card should plug into any AGP slot.
>>
>> http://www.eyeswatching.com/Assets/product_images/K078MX4000-T128-80.jpg
>>
>
> Here's a link to MSI's page on this card, http://tinyurl.com/2xrpem. This
> link shows a larger image, http://tinyurl.com/2bpdy6. The exact model
> number is 8936-550 with serial number B0408078346. It's the one with the
> gold anodized heat sink in the photo on MSI's site. The card appears to
> have both the 1.5v and 3.3v slots cut into it's connector.
>
>
>> The other part of the equation, is the nature of the chipset. Some
>> chipsets have more stable AGP interfaces than others. I learned that
>> first hand, from an old ALI chipset. I don't know what chipset your
>> S1590 uses. To make them stable, sometimes it requires reducing the
>> AGP speed setting in the BIOS. In other cases, the BIOS will have
>> "drive strength" settings for the AGP bus drivers on the Northbridge.
>
> The S1590 uses the Via MVP3 chipset. My current configuration has been
> running very smoothly since I built the computer almost 8 years ago. I sort
> of hate to make major changes though it would be nice to have a better video
> card to potentially play DVDs without any flicker. The machine has had an
> upgraded power supply to a unit from PC Power & Cooling as well as a couple
> of hard drive upgrades (currently running two 18GB U2W scsi drives, scsi
> Teac CDRW and scsi Toshiba DVD), and additional memory. I have a scsi zip
> drive as well but they've been made pretty much obsolete by the
> proliferation of USB flash drives.
>
>
>> The FTP files on the Tyan site are not archived, but you can dig up
>> a bit of stuff for an old board, from web.archive.org . I expect
>> a lot of the info here, is out of date and irrelevant.
>>
>> http://web.archive.org/web/20000517032907/www.tyan.com/support/html/s1..._agp_fa
>> http://web.archive.org/web/20000517161056/http://www.tyan.com/support/...l/s1590
>>
>
> Thanks again for the links. I have a lot of this stuff printed out and
> saved from when I put the machine together. I will have to dig through it
> once more.
>
> Eric

The playtool page lists the MVP3 as "AGP 3.3V Motherboard", more or less as
expected judging by the age of the product. Since the table entry for the
"Universal AGP 3.0 Card" shows it works with everything, it should not be
a problem electrically.

The way the card works, is the TYPEDEF pin specifies the card's preferred
voltage. Your MX4000 would ask for 1.5V, if a "coin toss" is required. But
the card will also run just fine with 3.3V, if the motherboard is old enough
that it doesn't look at the TYPEDET signal.

To give you an example, I have an FX5200 video card, of the same classification
as the MX4000. I have a 440BX based motherboard, which is the same classification
as your motherboard. I have tested two brands of FX5200 in that machine, and both
work. Since the 440BX is pretty healthy as AGP slots go, I wasn't expecting
a problem. If there is going to be a problem with old boards like that,
it comes from the powering scheme.

Years ago, I think I tried a TNT2 AGP card, and that didn't work. The theory
at the time, was that the 3.3V consumption of that card, would have been too
much for the motherboard. I believe, for whatever reason, that even if the
board is only capable of supplying 3.3V, they provide the 3.3V from a
motherboard regulator, rather than coming from the power supply directly.
A partial reason for doing this, is some designs "goosed" the rail, and actually
put out a bit more than 3.3V. That wouldn't have been possible if they took
3.3V right from the power supply. Other than that, I honestly don't know why a
3.3V I/O voltage only AGP motherboard, would use its own onboard regulator
for powering.

If this is an issue, when you plug in the MX4000 and turn it on, you'll get a
black screen. There was no damage to my motherboard (presumably the regulator
in question has overcurrent protection).

What remains, is for you to research the stability of the MVP3. When I
tried this search, it says there are 40,000 results. More than I can
read right now

http://groups.google.ca/groups/search?q=mvp3+agp

I think I'd still give it a shot, as so far there is no indication the
combination of parts is destructive.

Paul
 >> Stay informed about: S1590 with AGP8x? 

Paul wrote:
>
> The playtool page lists the MVP3 as "AGP 3.3V Motherboard", more or less
> as expected judging by the age of the product. Since the table entry for
> the "Universal AGP 3.0 Card" shows it works with everything, it should not
> be a problem electrically.
>
> The way the card works, is the TYPEDEF pin specifies the card's preferred
> voltage. Your MX4000 would ask for 1.5V, if a "coin toss" is required. But
> the card will also run just fine with 3.3V, if the motherboard is old
> enough that it doesn't look at the TYPEDET signal.
>
> To give you an example, I have an FX5200 video card, of the same
> classification as the MX4000. I have a 440BX based motherboard, which is
> the same classification as your motherboard. I have tested two brands of
> FX5200 in that machine, and both work. Since the 440BX is pretty healthy
> as AGP slots go, I wasn't expecting a problem. If there is going to be a
> problem with old boards like that, it comes from the powering scheme.

That's one of the things I'm concerned about, that the MX4000 card could
draw too much current and that the motherboard's circuits couldn't handle
the demand.

> Years ago, I think I tried a TNT2 AGP card, and that didn't work. The
> theory at the time, was that the 3.3V consumption of that card, would
> have been too much for the motherboard. I believe, for whatever reason,
> that even if the board is only capable of supplying 3.3V, they provide
> the 3.3V from a motherboard regulator, rather than coming from the power
> supply directly. A partial reason for doing this, is some designs
> "goosed" the rail, and actually put out a bit more than 3.3V. That
> wouldn't have been possible if they took 3.3V right from the power
> supply. Other than that, I honestly don't know why a 3.3V I/O voltage
> only AGP motherboard, would use its own onboard regulator for powering.

The Tyan S1590 is an AT board. Thus, there's no option to use the power
supply for 3.3v. By the way, I recall reading some posts about people
successfully using an Asus AGP-V3800 TNT2 card with their Tyan S1590 so
maybe the MX4000 won't be too far of a stretch? Note that for some reason
I'm not able to find those posts at this time.

>
> If this is an issue, when you plug in the MX4000 and turn it on, you'll
> get a black screen. There was no damage to my motherboard (presumably the
> regulator in question has overcurrent protection).

I'll have to take a closer look at the regulator chips on the motherboard.
Perhaps there's a part number on them which will allow me to find the specs
online. Still, I would then need to find out how much current the MX4000
draws in order to do a comparison. Short of finding that information online
somewhere, I'm not sure where to begin. I've tried doing a few Google
searches but came up empty so far.

>
> What remains, is for you to research the stability of the MVP3. When I
> tried this search, it says there are 40,000 results. More than I can
> read right now
>
> http://groups.google.ca/groups/search?q=mvp3+agp
>
> I think I'd still give it a shot, as so far there is no indication the
> combination of parts is destructive.
>
> Paul

Add 'tyan' to that search phrase and it cuts it down to a more manageable
1800 or so. Still, I didn't find any useful info though.

Eric
 >> Stay informed about: S1590 with AGP8x? 

this is the only hint for downwardcompatibility i found in the list :
"AGP 4X/2X and AGP Texturing Support" , but if you don't care so much
for the card you can try because the mb shouldn't suffer from this .
maybe paul comes up with one more experts statement .

i would try anyway .

In article <46A1F58E.C3DAADA2 RemoveThis @spam.now>, say.no RemoveThis @spam.now says...
> wolfgang schneider wrote:
> >
> > hi ,
> >
> > if this videocard isn't compatible with agp 1 or agp 2 ( which i doubt )
> > and it would fit into the slot , you even might destroy it .
>
> Thanks for the reply. I'm not so concerned with damaging the video card,
> I'm more concerned with damaging my motherboard. Please see my reply to
> Paul's post regarding the slot connector and which also has links to MSI's
> details of the card.
>
> Thanks again, Eric
>

--
gravity is still active
-<--@
gruss , wolfgang
 >> Stay informed about: S1590 with AGP8x?