under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400)

Somewhere on the interweb "Brett Kline" typed:
> Gary Beard wrote:
> > I built a new system and purchased Patriots PC2-6400 DDR2 RAM (800
> > Mhz). Patriot recommends timings of 4-4-4-12 at 2.2v but my
> > motherboard (Gigabyte M61SME-S2) will not let me change the voltage
> > to the RAM, which is 1.8v. I have set the timing at 5-5-5-15. Can
> > someone confirm that this is
> > the right direction to go with this rig?
>
>
> Try "Ctrl+F1" for advanced settings.

Yeah! It's a Gigabyte, I forgot about that,

Gary, press <delete> to get to the first page of the BIOS, then, while
there, press <Ctrl> + <F1> together. With *some* Gigabyte boards this brings
up 'hidden' settings (hidden so that Joe User can't wreck something).

S'funny, I've never seen that <Ctrl> + <F1> thing mentioned in a Gigabyte
manual yet I've had it work a couple times now.
--
TTFN

Shaun.
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

I can get into the bios AND into the advanced features with <Ctrl>+<F1> but
the board will not allow me to change the voltage to the RAM (unless I
missed something...it's greyed out and not selectable). As far as I can
tell I'm stuck with the 1.8v to the RAM and want to make sure I'm getting
the most out of the 2.2v RAM that I can at this lower voltage.
At 4-4-4-12 timings I get a frame flicker about every 10 seconds in heavy 3d
applications. At 5-5-5-15 it seems much better, although I still get the
flicker about every 20 seconds, but only occassionally in heavy 3d
applications (when the kids are gaming). The RAM seems fine any other
time...browsing the web, runnnig MS Office, reading mail, Spider Solitaire.
Never notice anything while running these apps.


"~misfit~" <misfit61nz.RemoveThis@yahooligans.co.nz> wrote in message
news:fg785r$ukv$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> Somewhere on the interweb "Brett Kline" typed:
>> Gary Beard wrote:
>> > I built a new system and purchased Patriots PC2-6400 DDR2 RAM (800
>> > Mhz). Patriot recommends timings of 4-4-4-12 at 2.2v but my
>> > motherboard (Gigabyte M61SME-S2) will not let me change the voltage
>> > to the RAM, which is 1.8v. I have set the timing at 5-5-5-15. Can
>> > someone confirm that this is
>> > the right direction to go with this rig?
>>
>>
>> Try "Ctrl+F1" for advanced settings.
>
> Yeah! It's a Gigabyte, I forgot about that,
>
> Gary, press <delete> to get to the first page of the BIOS, then, while
> there, press <Ctrl> + <F1> together. With *some* Gigabyte boards this
> brings up 'hidden' settings (hidden so that Joe User can't wreck
> something).
>
> S'funny, I've never seen that <Ctrl> + <F1> thing mentioned in a Gigabyte
> manual yet I've had it work a couple times now.
> --
> TTFN
>
> Shaun.
>
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

Gary Beard wrote:
> I can get into the bios AND into the advanced features with
> <Ctrl>+<F1> but the board will not allow me to change the voltage to
> the RAM (unless I missed something...it's greyed out and not
> selectable). As far as I can tell I'm stuck with the 1.8v to the RAM
> and want to make sure I'm getting the most out of the 2.2v RAM that I
> can at this lower voltage. At 4-4-4-12 timings I get a frame flicker about
> every 10 seconds in
> heavy 3d applications. At 5-5-5-15 it seems much better, although I
> still get the flicker about every 20 seconds, but only occassionally
> in heavy 3d applications (when the kids are gaming). The RAM seems
> fine any other time...browsing the web, runnnig MS Office, reading
> mail, Spider Solitaire. Never notice anything while running these
> apps.
>

Page 10 says it supports "1.8V DDRII DIMMs".
Page 42 of manual 2002 shows "PC Health Status" but it doesn't look like
Vcore nor Vdimm is adjustable. You could try updating to the F5 BIOS to see
if it adds this functionality. If you do, use the DOS floppy method.
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

<Top Posting fixed>

Somewhere on the interweb "Gary Beard" typed:
> "~misfit~" <misfit61nz.TakeThisOut@yahooligans.co.nz> wrote in message
> news:fg785r$ukv$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> > Somewhere on the interweb "Brett Kline" typed:
> > > Gary Beard wrote:
> > > > I built a new system and purchased Patriots PC2-6400 DDR2 RAM
> > > > (800 Mhz). Patriot recommends timings of 4-4-4-12 at 2.2v but my
> > > > motherboard (Gigabyte M61SME-S2) will not let me change the
> > > > voltage to the RAM, which is 1.8v. I have set the timing at
> > > > 5-5-5-15. Can someone confirm that this is
> > > > the right direction to go with this rig?
> > >
> > >
> > > Try "Ctrl+F1" for advanced settings.
> >
> > Yeah! It's a Gigabyte, I forgot about that,
> >
> > Gary, press <delete> to get to the first page of the BIOS, then,
> > while there, press <Ctrl> + <F1> together. With *some* Gigabyte
> > boards this brings up 'hidden' settings (hidden so that Joe User
> > can't wreck something).
> >
> > S'funny, I've never seen that <Ctrl> + <F1> thing mentioned in a
> > Gigabyte manual yet I've had it work a couple times now.
> >
> I can get into the bios AND into the advanced features with
> <Ctrl>+<F1> but the board will not allow me to change the voltage to
> the RAM (unless I missed something...it's greyed out and not
> selectable). As far as I can tell I'm stuck with the 1.8v to the RAM
> and want to make sure I'm getting the most out of the 2.2v RAM that I
> can at this lower voltage.

Set it to 667 (or maybe even 533).

> At 4-4-4-12 timings I get a frame flicker about every 10 seconds in
> heavy 3d applications. At 5-5-5-15 it seems much better, although I
> still get the flicker about every 20 seconds, but only occassionally
> in heavy 3d applications (when the kids are gaming). The RAM seems
> fine any other time...browsing the web, runnnig MS Office, reading
> mail, Spider Solitaire. Never notice anything while running these
> apps.

Odd that you get a "flicker". It could be that the board adjusts the timings
on-the-fly if they're producing errors?

Form the sounds of it you've got a compatibility problem between your board
and your RAM. 2.2v is a non-standard voltage, you bought "overclockers RAM"
for a board that doesn't allow the parameters required. Kinda like buying a
blow-off valve and turbo-timer for a non-turbocharged car. (You can still
fit it but you aren't going to see any performance benefit). Did you buy the
gear locally? I'd suggest you change either the board or the RAM. If not,
can you force the RAM to a slower mode? Try 667, set it manually in BIOS
(not "by SPD").

The extra voltage required is to get it running at the faster MHz. I don't
think you're going to get it to run at 800 @ 1.8v reliably no matter the
timings. (I could be wrong...)
--
TTFN

Shaun.
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

'~misfit' wrote:
| Form the sounds of it you've got a compatibility problem between your
board
| and your RAM. 2.2v is a non-standard voltage, you bought "overclockers
RAM"
| for a board that doesn't allow the parameters required. Kinda like buying
a
| blow-off valve and turbo-timer for a non-turbocharged car.
_____

I think you are 100% right. That's SLI-ready memory with an extended SPD
that has the timings and voltages for non-standard operating speeds. There
is an applet that can read the extended SPD on the memory modules, but, like
you, I don't think that will help much with a motherboard that seems
designed to be small and inexpensive rather than overclockable.

Phil Weldon

"~misfit~" <misfit61nz.DeleteThis@yahooligans.co.nz> wrote in message
news:fg8gls$42e$1@registered.motzarella.org...
| <Top Posting fixed>
|
| Somewhere on the interweb "Gary Beard" typed:
| > "~misfit~" <misfit61nz.DeleteThis@yahooligans.co.nz> wrote in message
| > news:fg785r$ukv$1@registered.motzarella.org...
| > > Somewhere on the interweb "Brett Kline" typed:
| > > > Gary Beard wrote:
| > > > > I built a new system and purchased Patriots PC2-6400 DDR2 RAM
| > > > > (800 Mhz). Patriot recommends timings of 4-4-4-12 at 2.2v but my
| > > > > motherboard (Gigabyte M61SME-S2) will not let me change the
| > > > > voltage to the RAM, which is 1.8v. I have set the timing at
| > > > > 5-5-5-15. Can someone confirm that this is
| > > > > the right direction to go with this rig?
| > > >
| > > >
| > > > Try "Ctrl+F1" for advanced settings.
| > >
| > > Yeah! It's a Gigabyte, I forgot about that,
| > >
| > > Gary, press <delete> to get to the first page of the BIOS, then,
| > > while there, press <Ctrl> + <F1> together. With *some* Gigabyte
| > > boards this brings up 'hidden' settings (hidden so that Joe User
| > > can't wreck something).
| > >
| > > S'funny, I've never seen that <Ctrl> + <F1> thing mentioned in a
| > > Gigabyte manual yet I've had it work a couple times now.
| > >
| > I can get into the bios AND into the advanced features with
| > <Ctrl>+<F1> but the board will not allow me to change the voltage to
| > the RAM (unless I missed something...it's greyed out and not
| > selectable). As far as I can tell I'm stuck with the 1.8v to the RAM
| > and want to make sure I'm getting the most out of the 2.2v RAM that I
| > can at this lower voltage.
|
| Set it to 667 (or maybe even 533).
|
| > At 4-4-4-12 timings I get a frame flicker about every 10 seconds in
| > heavy 3d applications. At 5-5-5-15 it seems much better, although I
| > still get the flicker about every 20 seconds, but only occassionally
| > in heavy 3d applications (when the kids are gaming). The RAM seems
| > fine any other time...browsing the web, runnnig MS Office, reading
| > mail, Spider Solitaire. Never notice anything while running these
| > apps.
|
| Odd that you get a "flicker". It could be that the board adjusts the
timings
| on-the-fly if they're producing errors?
|
| Form the sounds of it you've got a compatibility problem between your
board
| and your RAM. 2.2v is a non-standard voltage, you bought "overclockers
RAM"
| for a board that doesn't allow the parameters required. Kinda like buying
a
| blow-off valve and turbo-timer for a non-turbocharged car. (You can still
| fit it but you aren't going to see any performance benefit). Did you buy
the
| gear locally? I'd suggest you change either the board or the RAM. If not,
| can you force the RAM to a slower mode? Try 667, set it manually in BIOS
| (not "by SPD").
|
| The extra voltage required is to get it running at the faster MHz. I don't
| think you're going to get it to run at 800 @ 1.8v reliably no matter the
| timings. (I could be wrong...)
| --
| TTFN
|
| Shaun.
|
|
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

>
> Odd that you get a "flicker". It could be that the board adjusts the
> timings on-the-fly if they're producing errors?
>
> Form the sounds of it you've got a compatibility problem between your
> board and your RAM. 2.2v is a non-standard voltage, you bought
> "overclockers RAM" for a board that doesn't allow the parameters required.
> Kinda like buying a blow-off valve and turbo-timer for a non-turbocharged
> car. (You can still fit it but you aren't going to see any performance
> benefit). Did you buy the gear locally? I'd suggest you change either the
> board or the RAM. If not, can you force the RAM to a slower mode? Try 667,
> set it manually in BIOS (not "by SPD").
>
> The extra voltage required is to get it running at the faster MHz. I don't
> think you're going to get it to run at 800 @ 1.8v reliably no matter the
> timings. (I could be wrong...)
> --
> TTFN
>
> Shaun.
>

I noticed the timing was set back to 4-4-4-12 when I was getting the
flicker. It's fine at 5-5-5-15 and set to 800. I can reduce it to 667 or
533, but what timings (roughly) should I expect it to run most efficiently
at?

I updated to the F4 bios and the Dimm voltage is still not adjustable.

CPU-Z shows the RAM frequency at 368.3 and a FSB:DRAM of CPU/6
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

> I updated to the F4 bios and the Dimm voltage is still not adjustable.


I meant F5 bios!
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

Somewhere on the interweb "Gary Beard" typed:
> > Odd that you get a "flicker". It could be that the board adjusts the
> > timings on-the-fly if they're producing errors?
> >
> > Form the sounds of it you've got a compatibility problem between
> > your board and your RAM. 2.2v is a non-standard voltage, you bought
> > "overclockers RAM" for a board that doesn't allow the parameters
> > required. Kinda like buying a blow-off valve and turbo-timer for a
> > non-turbocharged car. (You can still fit it but you aren't going to
> > see any performance benefit). Did you buy the gear locally? I'd
> > suggest you change either the board or the RAM. If not, can you
> > force the RAM to a slower mode? Try 667, set it manually in BIOS
> > (not "by SPD"). The extra voltage required is to get it running at the
> > faster MHz.
> > I don't think you're going to get it to run at 800 @ 1.8v reliably
> > no matter the timings. (I could be wrong...)
>
> I noticed the timing was set back to 4-4-4-12 when I was getting the
> flicker. It's fine at 5-5-5-15 and set to 800. I can reduce it to
> 667 or 533, but what timings (roughly) should I expect it to run most
> efficiently at?
>
> I updated to the F4 bios and the Dimm voltage is still not adjustable.
>
> CPU-Z shows the RAM frequency at 368.3 and a FSB:DRAM of CPU/6

Hi Gary,

I'm sorry mate, I don't have first-hand experience with DDR2 (I'm running a
C2D with DDR RAM). Anything I said would be mere speculation. My previous
post was based on observing this thread. Perhaps someone else can answer
this for you? Or perhaps, no matter what your settings, without the 2.2v
non-standard setting that the RAM is rated for it'll always run like a
three-legged dog.

Personally I think that, with that board, you need to exchange the RAM you
have and go for some RAM that uses standard voltages. I know I wouldn't be
comfortable (essentially) undervolting my RAM by 20% and expecting it to be
stable.

Good luck,
--
TTFN

Shaun.
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

At 5-5-5-15 I'm not having any problems. It's perfectly stable. The
"jitters" at 4-4-4-12 are hardly noticable. I just want to make sure I'm
running as optimally as possible.

Will under volting RAM damage the RAM?

> Hi Gary,
>
> I'm sorry mate, I don't have first-hand experience with DDR2 (I'm running
> a C2D with DDR RAM). Anything I said would be mere speculation. My
> previous post was based on observing this thread. Perhaps someone else can
> answer this for you? Or perhaps, no matter what your settings, without the
> 2.2v non-standard setting that the RAM is rated for it'll always run like
> a three-legged dog.
>
> Personally I think that, with that board, you need to exchange the RAM you
> have and go for some RAM that uses standard voltages. I know I wouldn't be
> comfortable (essentially) undervolting my RAM by 20% and expecting it to
> be stable.
>
> Good luck,
> --
> TTFN
>
> Shaun.
>
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

Somewhere on the interweb "Gary Beard" typed:
> At 5-5-5-15 I'm not having any problems. It's perfectly stable.

Define "perfectly stable". Does it pass Memtest86+ overnight? If it doesn't,
it isn't perfectly stable.

> The
> "jitters" at 4-4-4-12 are hardly noticable.

Hmmm. To me they still indicate memory errors, or at least double-checks of
some kind.

> I just want to make sure
> I'm running as optimally as possible.

Indeed.

> Will under volting RAM damage the RAM?

To the best of my knowledge, no. (It'll only create memory errors) However,
I don't make any claims to be an expert in this field.
--
TTFN

Shaun.

> > Hi Gary,
> >
> > I'm sorry mate, I don't have first-hand experience with DDR2 (I'm
> > running a C2D with DDR RAM). Anything I said would be mere
> > speculation. My previous post was based on observing this thread.
> > Perhaps someone else can answer this for you? Or perhaps, no matter
> > what your settings, without the 2.2v non-standard setting that the RAM
> > is rated for it'll always
> > run like a three-legged dog.
> >
> > Personally I think that, with that board, you need to exchange the
> > RAM you have and go for some RAM that uses standard voltages. I
> > know I wouldn't be comfortable (essentially) undervolting my RAM by
> > 20% and expecting it to be stable.
> >
> > Good luck,
> > --
> > TTFN
> >
> > Shaun.
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

Shaun,
Thanks for all your help...I really appreciate it.
I found out that the SPD timings are 5-5-5-16 to work with 1.8v boards.
By "perfectly stable" I meant I have no "jitters" and no system crashes. I
did not there were no errors. I just wasn't noticing any problems that
might lend itself to being the RAM.
I have to replace my floppy drive, so I can't run Memtest86+. I did run
Memtest (not sure if it is a prior version or not, but it runs in Windows.
The RAM didn't produce any errors through that test (not to say it wouldn't
under Memtest86+).

Thanks again,
Gary




"~misfit~" <misfit61nz.RemoveThis@yahooligans.co.nz> wrote in message
news:fgbocd$o22$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> Somewhere on the interweb "Gary Beard" typed:
>> At 5-5-5-15 I'm not having any problems. It's perfectly stable.
>
> Define "perfectly stable". Does it pass Memtest86+ overnight? If it
> doesn't, it isn't perfectly stable.
>
>> The
>> "jitters" at 4-4-4-12 are hardly noticable.
>
> Hmmm. To me they still indicate memory errors, or at least double-checks
> of some kind.
>
>> I just want to make sure
>> I'm running as optimally as possible.
>
> Indeed.
>
>> Will under volting RAM damage the RAM?
>
> To the best of my knowledge, no. (It'll only create memory errors)
> However, I don't make any claims to be an expert in this field.
> --
> TTFN
>
> Shaun.
>
>> > Hi Gary,
>> >
>> > I'm sorry mate, I don't have first-hand experience with DDR2 (I'm
>> > running a C2D with DDR RAM). Anything I said would be mere
>> > speculation. My previous post was based on observing this thread.
>> > Perhaps someone else can answer this for you? Or perhaps, no matter
>> > what your settings, without the 2.2v non-standard setting that the RAM
>> > is rated for it'll always
>> > run like a three-legged dog.
>> >
>> > Personally I think that, with that board, you need to exchange the
>> > RAM you have and go for some RAM that uses standard voltages. I
>> > know I wouldn't be comfortable (essentially) undervolting my RAM by
>> > 20% and expecting it to be stable.
>> >
>> > Good luck,
>> > --
>> > TTFN
>> >
>> > Shaun.
>
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

Gary Beard wrote:
> I have to replace my floppy drive, so I can't run Memtest86+. I did
> run Memtest (not sure if it is a prior version or not, but it runs in
> Windows. The RAM didn't produce any errors through that test (not to
> say it wouldn't under Memtest86+).


Burn the ISO to a CD then boot from it.
http://www.memtest.org/#downiso
Download - Pre-Compiled Bootable ISO (.zip)
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400) 

Somewhere on the interweb "Gary Beard" typed:
> Shaun,
> Thanks for all your help...I really appreciate it.

Welcome.

> I found out that the SPD timings are 5-5-5-16 to work with 1.8v
> boards. By "perfectly stable" I meant I have no "jitters" and no system
> crashes. I did not there were no errors. I just wasn't noticing any
> problems that might lend itself to being the RAM.

Call me particular (or peculiar, LOL) but I won't run a system that isn't
Memtest and Prime stable. Overclcoking isn't just about getting it to go
fast, it's getting it to go fast *and* be stable.

> I have to replace my floppy drive, so I can't run Memtest86+. I did
> run Memtest (not sure if it is a prior version or not, but it runs in
> Windows. The RAM didn't produce any errors through that test (not to
> say it wouldn't under Memtest86+).

As Brett pointed out, you can run Memtest from a CD. I do. (Although I
still have a floppy drive installed for BIOS updates)

> Thanks again,

You're welcome.
--
Shaun.

>
> "~misfit~" <misfit61nz.DeleteThis@yahooligans.co.nz> wrote in message
> news:fgbocd$o22$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> > Somewhere on the interweb "Gary Beard" typed:
> > > At 5-5-5-15 I'm not having any problems. It's perfectly stable.
> >
> > Define "perfectly stable". Does it pass Memtest86+ overnight? If it
> > doesn't, it isn't perfectly stable.
> >
> > > The
> > > "jitters" at 4-4-4-12 are hardly noticable.
> >
> > Hmmm. To me they still indicate memory errors, or at least
> > double-checks of some kind.
> >
> > > I just want to make sure
> > > I'm running as optimally as possible.
> >
> > Indeed.
> >
> > > Will under volting RAM damage the RAM?
> >
> > To the best of my knowledge, no. (It'll only create memory errors)
> > However, I don't make any claims to be an expert in this field.
> > --
> > TTFN
> >
> > Shaun.
> >
> > > > Hi Gary,
> > > >
> > > > I'm sorry mate, I don't have first-hand experience with DDR2
> > > > (I'm running a C2D with DDR RAM). Anything I said would be mere
> > > > speculation. My previous post was based on observing this
> > > > thread. Perhaps someone else can answer this for you? Or
> > > > perhaps, no matter what your settings, without the 2.2v
> > > > non-standard setting that the RAM is rated for it'll always
> > > > run like a three-legged dog.
> > > >
> > > > Personally I think that, with that board, you need to exchange
> > > > the RAM you have and go for some RAM that uses standard
> > > > voltages. I know I wouldn't be comfortable (essentially)
> > > > undervolting my
> > > > RAM by 20% and expecting it to be stable.
> > > >
> > > > Good luck,
> > > > --
> > > > TTFN
> > > >
> > > > Shaun.
 >> Stay informed about: under-volt RAM timings (Patriot PC2-6400)